Discussion:
[Opensg-users] Material Override
Michael Raab
2014-09-30 10:28:37 UTC
Permalink
<html><head></head><body><div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;"><div>Hi,</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>I would like to highlight selected objects/geometries. Therefore I currently go through all materials/materialgroups of the subtree and replace the ChunkMaterial by a MPM to render the highlighting effect in a second pass. Works but has some management drawbacks..</div>

<div>I was wondering if there is the possibity to define this behavior somewhere near the root of the subtree, e.g. insert a special core that defines that after normal rendering of the subtree, the whole subtree gets again rendering with a certain highlight material. Has OpenSG currently something like this? If not, do you think it can be implemented straightforward? Could you give me a hint how?</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>Thanks in advance,</div>

<div>Michael</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div></div></body></html>
Marcus Lindblom Sonestedt
2014-09-30 11:16:41 UTC
Permalink
There is a chunkoverridegroup or something, if I recall correctly.

/Marcus
Den 30 sep 2014 12:32 skrev "Michael Raab" <michael-***@gmx.de>:

> Hi,
>
> I would like to highlight selected objects/geometries. Therefore I
> currently go through all materials/materialgroups of the subtree and
> replace the ChunkMaterial by a MPM to render the highlighting effect in a
> second pass. Works but has some management drawbacks..
> I was wondering if there is the possibity to define this behavior
> somewhere near the root of the subtree, e.g. insert a special core that
> defines that after normal rendering of the subtree, the whole subtree gets
> again rendering with a certain highlight material. Has OpenSG currently
> something like this? If not, do you think it can be implemented
> straightforward? Could you give me a hint how?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Michael
>
>
>
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Michael Raab
2014-09-30 11:27:13 UTC
Permalink
<html><head></head><body><div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;"><div>
<div>Yes, I already found that, but as far as I understand the concepts behind, with those cores I can only overwrite certain chunks. What I would like to accomplish is to override/extend all materials below, without knowing or naming them explicitly.</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>Michael</div>

<div>&nbsp;
<div name="quote" style="margin:10px 5px 5px 10px; padding: 10px 0 10px 10px; border-left:2px solid #C3D9E5; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">
<div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b>&nbsp;Dienstag, 30. September 2014 um 13:16 Uhr<br/>
<b>Von:</b>&nbsp;&quot;Marcus Lindblom Sonestedt&quot; &lt;***@yar.nu&gt;<br/>
<b>An:</b>&nbsp;opensg-***@lists.sourceforge.net<br/>
<b>Betreff:</b>&nbsp;Re: [Opensg-users] Material Override</div>

<div name="quoted-content">
<p>There is a chunkoverridegroup or something, if I recall correctly.</p>

<p>/Marcus</p>

<div class="gmail_quote">Den 30 sep 2014 12:32 skrev &quot;Michael Raab&quot; &lt;<a href="michael-***@gmx.de" target="_parent">michael-***@gmx.de</a>&gt;:

<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0 0 0 0.8ex;border-left: 1.0px rgb(204,204,204) solid;padding-left: 1.0ex;">
<div>
<div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;">
<div>Hi,</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>I would like to highlight selected objects/geometries. Therefore I currently go through all materials/materialgroups of the subtree and replace the ChunkMaterial by a MPM to render the highlighting effect in a second pass. Works but has some management drawbacks..</div>

<div>I was wondering if there is the possibity to define this behavior somewhere near the root of the subtree, e.g. insert a special core that defines that after normal rendering of the subtree, the whole subtree gets again rendering with a certain highlight material. Has OpenSG currently something like this? If not, do you think it can be implemented straightforward? Could you give me a hint how?</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>Thanks in advance,</div>

<div>Michael</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
</div>
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Victor Haefner
2014-09-30 11:50:26 UTC
Permalink
hi,

what about the MaterialGroup ? I havn't used it yet but it could override
the materials of the geometries.

Victor

On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 1:27 PM, Michael Raab <michael-***@gmx.de> wrote:

> Yes, I already found that, but as far as I understand the concepts behind,
> with those cores I can only overwrite certain chunks. What I would like to
> accomplish is to override/extend all materials below, without knowing or
> naming them explicitly.
>
> Michael
>
> *Gesendet:* Dienstag, 30. September 2014 um 13:16 Uhr
> *Von:* "Marcus Lindblom Sonestedt" <***@yar.nu>
> *An:* opensg-***@lists.sourceforge.net
> *Betreff:* Re: [Opensg-users] Material Override
>
> There is a chunkoverridegroup or something, if I recall correctly.
>
> /Marcus
> Den 30 sep 2014 12:32 skrev "Michael Raab" <michael-***@gmx.de>:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I would like to highlight selected objects/geometries. Therefore I
>> currently go through all materials/materialgroups of the subtree and
>> replace the ChunkMaterial by a MPM to render the highlighting effect in a
>> second pass. Works but has some management drawbacks..
>> I was wondering if there is the possibity to define this behavior
>> somewhere near the root of the subtree, e.g. insert a special core that
>> defines that after normal rendering of the subtree, the whole subtree gets
>> again rendering with a certain highlight material. Has OpenSG currently
>> something like this? If not, do you think it can be implemented
>> straightforward? Could you give me a hint how?
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> Michael
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
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Carsten Neumann
2014-09-30 12:40:39 UTC
Permalink
Hello Michael,

On 2014-09-30 12:28, Michael Raab wrote:
> I would like to highlight selected objects/geometries. Therefore I
> currently go through all materials/materialgroups of the subtree and
> replace the ChunkMaterial by a MPM to render the highlighting effect in
> a second pass. Works but has some management drawbacks..
> I was wondering if there is the possibity to define this behavior
> somewhere near the root of the subtree, e.g. insert a special core that
> defines that after normal rendering of the subtree, the whole subtree
> gets again rendering with a certain highlight material. Has OpenSG
> currently something like this?

Stages can be used to do that, but I don't think we currently have one
that does exactly:
- render sub tree normally
- render sub tree with all materials replaced by a given one

> If not, do you think it can be
> implemented straightforward? Could you give me a hint how?

You'd create your own core derived from Stage and use that to do your
two passes over the sub tree below it. For the second pass you'd set
action->overrideMaterial() (just like MaterialGroup does) to have your
highlight material take precedence over the materials on the geometry.

The backend representation of a pass is a RenderPartition which is what
your stage would create internally. An example of a stage that performs
multiple passes is the DepthPeelingStage in
System/NodeCores/Groups/Effects/OIT or the ShadowStage.
Unfortunately I think that all stages that run multiple passes are doing
rather complex things since so far a more straightforward use case like
yours has not come up - there are of course much simpler stages, but
they are all single pass IIRC.

Cheers,
Carsten
Michael Raab
2014-09-30 14:46:04 UTC
Permalink
Michael Raab
2014-10-01 07:54:50 UTC
Permalink
Carsten Neumann
2014-10-01 08:41:30 UTC
Permalink
Hello Michael,

On 09/30/2014 04:46 PM, Michael Raab wrote:
> thanks for your explanation. I followed your hint and tried implement a
> Stage similar to DepthPeelingStage but the rendering looks broken.
> The geometry to highlight looks like it is rendered unlit. I'm attaching
> the source code, maybe someone has some minutes to look at.

in your case I don't think you want to disable the default partition,
that is intended for Stages that want to take over rendering entirely [1].
You can also avoid having to copy the viewport and camera settings, by
changing the pushPartition call to:

this->pushPartition(a, RenderPartition::CopyAll);

I think it would also be better to set the override material on the
partition that should use it, instead of the parent partition and have
it inherited.
I'm thinking something like the attached (completely untested).

Cheers,
Carsten


[1] and probably only makes sense for stages that are used very near the
root of the scene - otherwise I think that is likely to skip rendering
of objects (namely those that have already been added to the default
partition).
Michael Raab
2014-10-01 09:27:50 UTC
Permalink
Works great. Thanks. Maybe a very short tutorial/explanation about stages, their capabilities and the rendering process in OpenSG2 would be useful ;-)

Michael

Am 01.10.2014 10:41 schrieb Carsten Neumann <***@gmail.com>:
>
> Hello Michael,
>
> On 09/30/2014 04:46 PM, Michael Raab wrote:
> > thanks for your explanation. I followed your hint and tried implement a
> > Stage similar to DepthPeelingStage but the rendering looks broken.
> > The geometry to highlight looks like it is rendered unlit. I'm attaching
> > the source code, maybe someone has some minutes to look at.
>
> in your case I don't think you want to disable the default partition,
> that is intended for Stages that want to take over rendering entirely [1].
> You can also avoid having to copy the viewport and camera settings, by
> changing the pushPartition call to:
>
> this->pushPartition(a, RenderPartition::CopyAll);
>
> I think it would also be better to set the override material on the
> partition that should use it, instead of the parent partition and have
> it inherited.
> I'm thinking something like the attached (completely untested).
>
> Cheers,
> Carsten
>
>
> [1] and probably only makes sense for stages that are used very near the
> root of the scene - otherwise I think that is likely to skip rendering
> of objects (namely those that have already been added to the default
> partition).
>
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Michael Raab
2014-10-01 12:14:40 UTC
Permalink
<html><head></head><body><div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;"><div>
<div>Hey,</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>I need to correct my answer. ;-) There are still problems with the visual overlay of the highlight material.</div>

<div>&nbsp;1.) If I use a wireframe as highlight the overlay works as expected..</div>

<div>&nbsp;2.) If I use GL_FILL for the highlight it is not rendered over the &#39;normal material&#39;. For example if I render a cube with backface culling enabled, I can see no difference form the outside, but inside I can see the highlight material.</div>

<div>My first guess was depth buffer related issueds. I already tried to manipulate the DepthChunk but even with GL_ALWAYS I can&#39;t see the highlight from the outside.</div>

<div>3.) If I use a transparent material as highlight, the transparency is only correct applied within the sub tree.</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>Thanks,</div>

<div>
<div>Michael</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div name="quote" style="margin:10px 5px 5px 10px; padding: 10px 0 10px 10px; border-left:2px solid #C3D9E5; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">
<div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b>&nbsp;Mittwoch, 01. Oktober 2014 um 11:27 Uhr<br/>
<b>Von:</b>&nbsp;&quot;Michael Raab&quot; &lt;michael-***@gmx.de&gt;<br/>
<b>An:</b>&nbsp;opensg-***@lists.sourceforge.net<br/>
<b>Betreff:</b>&nbsp;Re: [Opensg-users] Material Override</div>

<div name="quoted-content">Works great. Thanks. Maybe a very short tutorial/explanation about stages, their capabilities and the rendering process in OpenSG2 would be useful ;-)<br/>
<br/>
Michael<br/>
<br/>
Am 01.10.2014 10:41 schrieb Carsten Neumann &lt;***@gmail.com&gt;:<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt; Hello Michael,<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt; On 09/30/2014 04:46 PM, Michael Raab wrote:<br/>
&gt; &gt; thanks for your explanation. I followed your hint and tried implement a<br/>
&gt; &gt; Stage similar to DepthPeelingStage but the rendering looks broken.<br/>
&gt; &gt; The geometry to highlight looks like it is rendered unlit. I&#39;m attaching<br/>
&gt; &gt; the source code, maybe someone has some minutes to look at.<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt; in your case I don&#39;t think you want to disable the default partition,<br/>
&gt; that is intended for Stages that want to take over rendering entirely [1].<br/>
&gt; You can also avoid having to copy the viewport and camera settings, by<br/>
&gt; changing the pushPartition call to:<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt; this-&gt;pushPartition(a, RenderPartition::CopyAll);<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt; I think it would also be better to set the override material on the<br/>
&gt; partition that should use it, instead of the parent partition and have<br/>
&gt; it inherited.<br/>
&gt; I&#39;m thinking something like the attached (completely untested).<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt; Cheers,<br/>
&gt; Carsten<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt;<br/>
&gt; [1] and probably only makes sense for stages that are used very near the<br/>
&gt; root of the scene - otherwise I think that is likely to skip rendering<br/>
&gt; of objects (namely those that have already been added to the default<br/>
&gt; partition).<br/>
&gt;<br/>
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Carsten Neumann
2014-10-04 07:31:20 UTC
Permalink
Hello Michael,

On 10/01/2014 02:14 PM, Michael Raab wrote:
> I need to correct my answer. ;-) There are still problems with the
> visual overlay of the highlight material.
> 1.) If I use a wireframe as highlight the overlay works as expected..
> 2.) If I use GL_FILL for the highlight it is not rendered over the
> 'normal material'. For example if I render a cube with backface culling
> enabled, I can see no difference form the outside, but inside I can see
> the highlight material.
> My first guess was depth buffer related issueds. I already tried to
> manipulate the DepthChunk but even with GL_ALWAYS I can't see the
> highlight from the outside.
> 3.) If I use a transparent material as highlight, the transparency is
> only correct applied within the sub tree.

hmm, I had not considered how creating a new partition affects the
material sorting. So I think what we want here is that the stage does
not create new partitions, but only takes control over traversing the
tree below it. Can you try removing the {begin,end}PartitionGroup and
{push,pop}Partition calls? That should cause the objects to be added to
the parent partition and thus sort normally with them.

Cheers,
Carsten
Michael Raab
2014-10-07 11:14:33 UTC
Permalink
<html><head></head><body><div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;"><div>
<div>Hello Carsten,</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>this way works better. Thanks.</div>

<div>&nbsp;</div>

<div>Michael</div>

<div>&nbsp;
<div name="quote" style="margin:10px 5px 5px 10px; padding: 10px 0 10px 10px; border-left:2px solid #C3D9E5; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">
<div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b>&nbsp;Samstag, 04. Oktober 2014 um 09:31 Uhr<br/>
<b>Von:</b>&nbsp;&quot;Carsten Neumann&quot; &lt;***@gmail.com&gt;<br/>
<b>An:</b>&nbsp;opensg-***@lists.sourceforge.net<br/>
<b>Betreff:</b>&nbsp;Re: [Opensg-users] Material Override</div>

<div name="quoted-content">Hello Michael,<br/>
<br/>
On 10/01/2014 02:14 PM, Michael Raab wrote:<br/>
&gt; I need to correct my answer. ;-) There are still problems with the<br/>
&gt; visual overlay of the highlight material.<br/>
&gt; 1.) If I use a wireframe as highlight the overlay works as expected..<br/>
&gt; 2.) If I use GL_FILL for the highlight it is not rendered over the<br/>
&gt; &#39;normal material&#39;. For example if I render a cube with backface culling<br/>
&gt; enabled, I can see no difference form the outside, but inside I can see<br/>
&gt; the highlight material.<br/>
&gt; My first guess was depth buffer related issueds. I already tried to<br/>
&gt; manipulate the DepthChunk but even with GL_ALWAYS I can&#39;t see the<br/>
&gt; highlight from the outside.<br/>
&gt; 3.) If I use a transparent material as highlight, the transparency is<br/>
&gt; only correct applied within the sub tree.<br/>
<br/>
hmm, I had not considered how creating a new partition affects the<br/>
material sorting. So I think what we want here is that the stage does<br/>
not create new partitions, but only takes control over traversing the<br/>
tree below it. Can you try removing the {begin,end}PartitionGroup and<br/>
{push,pop}Partition calls? That should cause the objects to be added to<br/>
the parent partition and thus sort normally with them.<br/>
<br/>
Cheers,<br/>
Carsten<br/>
<br/>
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Michael Raab
2014-11-05 08:55:11 UTC
Permalink
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Carsten Neumann
2014-11-05 09:00:09 UTC
Permalink
Hello Michael,

On 11/05/2014 09:55 AM, Michael Raab wrote:
> Hello Carsten,
> I need to come back to this issue. I just realized that in certain
> situations it is not possible to override all material information below.
> For example if I want to highlight a sub tree that uses a clip chunk
> somewhere, I need to apply this clipping in the highlight pass, too.
> Is there a way to exclude certain chunk types from override?

I'm about to leave for travel, so this is a bit short:
The material override completely replaces the materials in the subtree,
no exceptions AFAIK. There is a ChunkOverrideGroup that selectively
allows overriding of certain chunks leaving the remaining chunks of a
mterial as is - however, there again the override chunk always takes
precedence over what is in the material.

Cheers,
Carsten

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